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smithscowboy

Joined: 04 May 2007 Posts: 90
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Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2007 8:43 pm Post subject: Am I deceiving this girl? |
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I met someone. In college. She's a really nice girl and I like her a lot. That's to put it simply.
I bind almost always or at least whenever I'm around her in college, and no one knows I'm trans (FTM) My chest surgery would've been taken care of by now but there's been trouble getting a surgeon. As far as I know, she doesn't know or has noticed anything either. She does think I'm 'different' from other guys though.
I've been really forward about liking her and I know she likes me back, but now lately I've felt like backing off and 'forgetting about it' because I feel it's too complicated to 'break' it to her and all that other stuff...
I don't know. Can someone help me out here? _________________ "We burn the fat off our souls... Hemingway said that..."
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Nathan Tzoner

Joined: 19 May 2007 Posts: 810 Location: Brighton
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Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2007 10:27 pm Post subject: |
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think of it as a deformity. i mean essentially it is a birth defect.
if you had a massive weird lump on your stomach wen and how wud you tell her about that? are you deceiving her by not telling her?
instead of a random lump on your stomach you have two on your chest. dont treat it any differently than any other physical medical condition. _________________ "...risk something, take back whats yours, say something that you know they might attack you for..."
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Han79

Joined: 05 Nov 2007 Posts: 365 Location: West Midlands - UK
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Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2007 11:05 pm Post subject: |
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You do need to come clean, how and when is the big question
I think if you really spent some time together, just to develop some trust etc etc you might find she's "ok" about it. _________________ Most of the time, most people do what most people do most of the time.
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Mike Tzoner


Joined: 09 Feb 2007 Posts: 1049 Location: North west, UK
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 7:54 am Post subject: |
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If I were you I would tell her. Its good that you've spent some time 2gether and she has got to know you for you first, so her reaction might be better than it would've been had you only just met, if you get me?
You deffo need to tell her tho, if you both like each other then surely at some stage either one of you are gunna wanna take it to the next step. So telling her before it gets that far is only fair in my opinion. You should have a rough guess at how she'd feel about it from spendin time with her, do you think she would freak out or is she an open minded sort of gal?
Some people might say why should you tell her...you're a man and bein trans is your business and no one elses and thats a fair point but also you have to look at it from her point of view. I dont know what she's like but if she's anythin like your average girl then she prob has no clue about anythin trans related so to say nothin then one day things go to the next step and she finds out that way would be wrong.
So yeah deffo tell her, and if she's a decent girl it wont make a difference. If she's freaked out and doesnt want anythin to do with you then she wasnt worth your time in the first place.
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CheekyCat
Joined: 20 Aug 2007 Posts: 458 Location: UK
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 9:39 am Post subject: |
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I'd define this as the classic conundrum for post transition trans people.........and I don't reckon there's a simple answer to your question!
I guess part of it depends on what is your own definition of "the next step"?
I wouldn't see the need to rush and tell someone right at the beginning of a relatonship before you've even been on a date.
But if you think the next step is to get intimate, or that you feel it's a relationship thats got a chance of developing into a long term thing, then you need to seriously think about telling them.
I've never really thought this through from a transguys perspective before and I'm sure some of the boys will have clearer insight on this question. But post operatively is it possible to be intimate with a partner without telling them?
Sorry for asking, but if the answer is no, then it kinda changes the dynamics of smithscowboys question, especially in terms of getting intimate with a partner! Does that make sense?
But in general, I'd say there's nothing wrong in trans people dating or having a casual fling with someone without telling them! It goes back to this old chestnut of setting ourselves apart and somehow feeling guilty about taking part in the normal process of life without feeling the need to tell people of our personal history! That being said, the complications may come into play when you get intimate with someone (depending upon the stage of physical transition) or if you feel that it could develop into a long term relationship.
Bottom line is though........theres no easy answer to your question! _________________ Cheeky Cat!
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GenderQuest

Joined: 12 Oct 2007 Posts: 451
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 2:03 pm Post subject: |
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As others have said, for a pre-op trans person it is a case of when, not if, a partner in an intimate relationship finds out. So maybe the question should be how/when to tell? Letting them find out for themselves via visual inspection probably won't get the best results, but it's a hard question to answer and it's not like there is one correct and best answer. Too early and there is the risk of rejection based on crude prejudices, too late and there is the risk of creating the feeling of having been lied to (just how someone might feel, not saying anyone is lying here). There is always the chance they already worked it out for themselves and are already cool about it
I know I'm going slightly off topic here, but it's in the same arena - my personal opinion is that sexual partners have a right to know about my (future) trans-status (i.e. after I'm done transitioning). I know there are people that will strongly disagree from their own point of view, and that is fine! The people that want to go deep stealth are quite entitled to. From my personal perspective there is no need for anyone to know anything about my trans status for anything other than sex (mean post-op ofc, it's pretty obvious right now  ). In my opinion people have the right to be fussy about their sexual partners. Nobody can demand that someone be sexually attracted to them and if there are people who would never want to sleep with a trans person (or some-one with black hair, or someone under 5'5") then I respect their right - it might be stupid but it >is< their choice. Any other issues with a trans person would be discrimination however and I would want to fight about that!!
Edit: But to climb off my little (personal) soap box and try and say something that might be helpful - you say she says you are 'different' to other guys - gently probe her on that subject, maybe she already knows or suspects something, or maybe it is simply your unique qualities - but that sounds like a promising angle to take.
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Flameboy Advisor


Joined: 29 Mar 2007 Posts: 1653 Location: Manchester
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 4:43 pm Post subject: |
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I agree that you should tell her before things progress too far, but that it's not an easy thing to tell someone. If you're really keen on her, and you think the relationship is a goer, it might be worth preparing some resources in advance that you can give her, so she can take something away with her to read or watch.
I'm sure there are people here who have been in your situation; with any luck someone with experience will be along shortly!
Dave
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Flameboy Advisor


Joined: 29 Mar 2007 Posts: 1653 Location: Manchester
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 4:51 pm Post subject: |
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| CheekyCat wrote: | I've never really thought this through from a transguys perspective before and I'm sure some of the boys will have clearer insight on this question. But post operatively is it possible to be intimate with a partner without telling them? |
Well, yes and no I guess. Following phalloplasty, if the operations are successful, a transguy can have an erection by pumping up the penis. So, obviously, a spontaneous erection can't occur. However, I'm pretty sure that the pump system is the same as the ones that are sometimes given to men with erectile disfunction - which I guess is kinda the case here! So, I suppose that if the phallo was realistic-looking enough - which some are, and some aren't - and the guy claimed to suffer from erectile disfunction, or only got hard after mysteriously disappearing off to the bathroom, and there was no visible scarring (or the partner didn't look close enough to see any scarring) - then yes, it would be possible to be intimate with a partner without telling them.
However, that's a LOT of ifs - and it's also important to bear in mind that the vast majority of transguys don't have phallos at all.
Dave
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Skyler Tzoner


Joined: 08 Feb 2007 Posts: 934 Location: Canada
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 4:53 pm Post subject: |
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there would also be a lack of ejaculation
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Juz Advisor


Joined: 09 Feb 2007 Posts: 1000
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 5:01 pm Post subject: |
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Tell her when you feel you're getting special for each other. Doing this in the right moment would be great, but in general it's better to be early than late, IMO.
It'd be good to let her a chance to know you as a person and to like you as a person, it can help in later acceptance.
I wouldn't advise you to talk about the subject as about physical medical condition (sorry, Nathan). For a random person a comparison between a lump on the stomach and being trans would not work. _________________ I have to EDIT because I can't SPELL!!
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CheekyCat
Joined: 20 Aug 2007 Posts: 458 Location: UK
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 5:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Flameboy wrote: | | CheekyCat wrote: | I've never really thought this through from a transguys perspective before and I'm sure some of the boys will have clearer insight on this question. But post operatively is it possible to be intimate with a partner without telling them? |
Well, yes and no I guess. Following phalloplasty, if the operations are successful, a transguy can have an erection by pumping up the penis. So, obviously, a spontaneous erection can't occur. However, I'm pretty sure that the pump system is the same as the ones that are sometimes given to men with erectile disfunction - which I guess is kinda the case here! So, I suppose that if the phallo was realistic-looking enough - which some are, and some aren't - and the guy claimed to suffer from erectile disfunction, or only got hard after mysteriously disappearing off to the bathroom, and there was no visible scarring (or the partner didn't look close enough to see any scarring) - then yes, it would be possible to be intimate with a partner without telling them.
However, that's a LOT of ifs - and it's also important to bear in mind that the vast majority of transguys don't have phallos at all.
Dave |
Thanks Dave, now I know!  _________________ Cheeky Cat!
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CheekyCat
Joined: 20 Aug 2007 Posts: 458 Location: UK
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 5:11 pm Post subject: |
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| GenderQuest wrote: | | Nobody can demand that someone be sexually attracted to them and if there are people who would never want to sleep with a trans person (or some-one with black hair, or someone under 5'5") then I respect their right - it might be stupid but it >is< their choice. |
I'm gonna play devils advocate here:-
Would you expect the blond haired women in the above example to tell the guy that she actually dyed her hair before sleeping with him? Or would the 5'5'' girl need to tell him that a few years ago she was only 4'11''? Surely if the person is attracted to them now, for the person that they are, then that is what matters? _________________ Cheeky Cat!
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Juz Advisor


Joined: 09 Feb 2007 Posts: 1000
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 5:20 pm Post subject: |
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Oh, and answering your question.
You're not deceiving her. It's feelings that matter in personal relationship and if you do have sincere feelings for her, you're true with her. You like her with your soul, with all your being, not with a missing part of your body. I mean unless you're interested in each other only as sex partners what I do not think is the case.
When she knows, she might reject you, might accept, it's impossible to say in advance.
It's better to tell her for you own good, too. If you let yourself to be too involved, you'd feel awful in case of rejection. To say it again, right time would be perfect, but better earlier than later.
I think, it's better to check water first. Don't crash the news at her all of a sudden.
You have quite a nice excuse to start a conversation. You mentioned she told you were 'different ' from other guys. Ask her why she thinks so and you'd get an opportunity to speak about yourself, your difference, etc. _________________ I have to EDIT because I can't SPELL!!
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GenderQuest

Joined: 12 Oct 2007 Posts: 451
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 5:31 pm Post subject: |
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| CheekyCat wrote: |
I'm gonna play devils advocate here:-
Would you expect the blond haired women in the above example to tell the guy that she actually dyed her hair before sleeping with him? Or would the 5'5'' girl need to tell him that a few years ago she was only 4'11''? Surely if the person is attracted to them now, for the person that they are, then that is what matters? |
Interesting. However I think this is mixing the examples, because the person that died the hair is the hair equivalent of trans (transcoiffure?). A person could theoretically be happy to sleep with a man or a woman, but not a transsexual. Similarly someone could be happy to sleep with a bonde or black haired person, but not someone who dyes their hair. Ok so silly examples, but someone could have those tastes and that would be acceptable IMO. My point is I believe people have the right to be as ridiculously fussy as they like when it comes to sexual partners (though someone that ws not prepared to sleep with someone who was ever under 5'5" has kind of limited options.... ).
I'm most certainly not trying to say that all trans people are morally obliged to tell all to any potential (or actual) partner or anyone at all. The points I am making are that I think it is reasonable for someone to care that a partner is trans, and that personally I would feel obliged to tell. I'll repeat that I have no issue with other people doing whatever they want to do
Oh and finally, what matters is a subjective thing and it is up to each person to decide what matters, on this most personal of issues. You certainly don't have to be politically correct when choosing a mate - your body, your rules.
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Juz Advisor


Joined: 09 Feb 2007 Posts: 1000
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 5:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Would you expect the blond haired women in the above example to tell the guy that she actually dyed her hair before sleeping with him? |
If having a natural blond girlfriend is really important for the guy, it should be only fair to tell him she dyed the hair.
Otherwise, no. Simply because it doesn't matter. In our time and culture, dying hair is totally accepted while being trans is not.
Also, no matter how deep and sincere feelings might be, body contact is a different thing. When a person is in a true and pure love that make him/her accept the date in any appearance he/she might have, it's great and it's the best that can be.
For the vast majority of people, though, the biological gender of a person is essential and they can't or do not want to look deeper.
| Quote: | | Or would the 5'5'' girl need to tell him that a few years ago she was only 4'11''? |
Or had spots all over her face, or didn't pronounce half the alphabet, etc., etc.
I do not see your point here at all.
Dating a trans is not the same as dating a person who used to have those minor problems. _________________ I have to EDIT because I can't SPELL!!
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