tzone

Emma Ephemera · Joined: 27 Oct 2007 Posts: 109

emrock wrote:

i guess it is a poor way of getting actual advice. i made the post when i was a bit down last night. I have a massive hang up in my forehead and i guess was wondering whether people thought that surgery on my forehead is worth it.

...

I did think it wasn't entirely in earnest, and that it had more do to with self-esteem. For that reason alone, I wasn't going to chip in with my opinion. But sometimes people will answer very bluntly, and that really doesn't do wonders for how you feel.

I also want to say, people who have had FFS can and do have huge hang ups about the way they look. Feeling good about your appearance is more on the inside than the outside.

**ice maiden** · Advisor Joined: 08 Feb 2007 Posts: 2691

I'll be completely honest. You don't have the most feminine face but I've seen more masculine faces on women in the supermarket (HFO)

PASS THE STANLEY KNIFE =|

Wink

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Man [...] must count no one but himself; that he is alone, abandoned on earth in the midst of his infinite responsibilities, without help, with no other aim than the one he sets himself, with no other destiny than the one he forges for himself on this earth." (Jean Paul Sartre, 1943)

la_glitch · Joined: 24 Feb 2007 Posts: 434

my opinion?

a bunch of trans-people are the absolute worst lot to ask for opinions on how you look.

my other opinion?

you need FFS as much as i do, and i survive quite happily because i am damn gorgeous. sure, like you, i hate my forehead and brow ridge, but it doesn't seem to have people pointing at me on the street in a invasion of the body snatchers style. so i'm mostly happy. you should be too.

Queen_Dennis · Joined: 07 Dec 2007 Posts: 154 Location: Manchester

Ah I just think you're gorgeous emrock... we will all have our own opinion I guess. Didn't really analyse why I think so - I was looking at your face as a whole but I did notice you have a particularly sweet smile...

and erm han.. I don't think your nose is big! You are also very beautiful. Smile

Guess in the end my opinion doesn't really matter.. The only opinion which is crucial is our own.

You've got to do whatever is right for you emrock.

CheekyCat · Joined: 20 Aug 2007 Posts: 458 Location: UK

Emma Ephemera wrote:

CheekyCat wrote:

Stella Maru wrote:

Emma Ephemera wrote:

This kind of question is a great way of fishing for compliments, but a poor way of getting advice.

Very well put. Smile

Out of order.

Why?

Also, which conference did you attend this year? I'm interested to know.

It wasn't so much your statement in it's full context that I was refering to.......more the cherry picking of statements to dismiss someone's genuine concerns as being nothing more than fishing for compliments. That is what is out of order.

The conference was Transgender 2007 at the University of East Anglia. An american surgeon, Dr Oustehous gave a lecture at the conference which was very interesting. Its the first time I had heard of FFS and a few of his ex patients were there who had had quite amazing results.......although admittedly others did have an obvious "facelift" look about them. I'd urge caution for anyone considering this due to the costs, but for some people it's certainly made a huge difference to their lives.

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Claudia · Tzoner Joined: 09 Feb 2007 Posts: 227

la_glitch wrote:

my opinion?

a bunch of trans-people are the absolute worst lot to ask for opinions on how you look..

Totally agree, most trans people, especially if they don't really know you will not give you a totally frank opinion (to your face, anyway, I hear a lot of bitching about 'her looking like a bloke' about other people, however!) - most people in the world are not trans, so if you look fine to them, then you have no problem. I can understand it being a cosmetic issue - I can guess you don't just want to be 'passable' or look 'good for someone who is trans' but who somebody who just looks good.
If you have a good mindset and are not relying on it to solve problems (which doesn't seem to be the case) or have financial issues, then I don't see why you shouldn't do it, I guess the main issue is whether it's worth the money and pain (I have heard the facial surgery can be rather painful)

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Emma Ephemera · Joined: 27 Oct 2007 Posts: 109

Claudia wrote:

la_glitch wrote:

my opinion?

a bunch of trans-people are the absolute worst lot to ask for opinions on how you look..

Totally agree, most trans people, especially if they don't really know you will not give you a totally frank opinion (to your face, anyway, I hear a lot of bitching about 'her looking like a bloke' about other people, however!) - most people in the world are not trans, so if you look fine to them, then you have no problem. I can understand it being a cosmetic issue - I can guess you don't just want to be 'passable' or look 'good for someone who is trans' but who somebody who just looks good.

If you have a good mindset and are not relying on it to solve problems (which doesn't seem to be the case) or have financial issues, then I don't see why you shouldn't do it, I guess the main issue is whether it's worth the money and pain (I have heard the facial surgery can be rather painful)

The thoughts that take place surrounding the decision to have or not have FFS are really complex, though I would say the greatest single motivation is simply not passing as female. Being visibly trans is a pain in the arse, and sometimes even dangerous. Getting threatened and assualted is not fun, and that kind of experience reinforces the fact that you don't pass, and puts it to the fore of your mind in a way that interferes with your day to day life.

In that way, the person who seeks FFS is looking for it to solve a problem, and is expecting a very definite outcome: passing. You can't always achieve that, as limitations exist, but most people are expectant. Some surgeons can quite radically alter the way you look, in the sense of masculine versus feminine, without losing the individual character of you face and without looking like you have had lots of plastic surgery.

Not all of them are expensive as Dr Ousterhout, though money seems to be a very big factor as to whether a person will or won't have FFS. It isn't cheap, and many people would put SRS ahead of it, which is understandable. I too have heard people say that the pain is excruciating, but I doubt it is really that bad for most, and certainly not something that can't be tolerated for the sake of looking better.

**Andee** · Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 10:31 pm Post subject:

I know I'm late to the party on this one, but I think your look fine -- much better than many GG women I see.

I've seen some of the work that Dr. O has done and it is quite amazing, but realistically he had a lot more work to do (hair line, brow ridge, cheeks, chin, and nose on one friend) because her facial features started out so stereotypically male AND she was much older than you when she decided that she wanted to transition.

As has been said by others -- your decision -- but you are starting off much more feminine than many of us.

-Andee

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Claudia · Tzoner Joined: 09 Feb 2007 Posts: 227

Emma Ephemera wrote:

Claudia wrote:

la_glitch wrote:

my opinion?

a bunch of trans-people are the absolute worst lot to ask for opinions on how you look..

Totally agree, most trans people, especially if they don't really know you will not give you a totally frank opinion (to your face, anyway, I hear a lot of bitching about 'her looking like a bloke' about other people, however!) - most people in the world are not trans, so if you look fine to them, then you have no problem. I can understand it being a cosmetic issue - I can guess you don't just want to be 'passable' or look 'good for someone who is trans' but who somebody who just looks good.

If you have a good mindset and are not relying on it to solve problems (which doesn't seem to be the case) or have financial issues, then I don't see why you shouldn't do it, I guess the main issue is whether it's worth the money and pain (I have heard the facial surgery can be rather painful)

The thoughts that take place surrounding the decision to have or not have FFS are really complex, though I would say the greatest single motivation is simply not passing as female. Being visibly trans is a pain in the arse, and sometimes even dangerous. Getting threatened and assualted is not fun, and that kind of experience reinforces the fact that you don't pass, and puts it to the fore of your mind in a way that interferes with your day to day life.

In that way, the person who seeks FFS is looking for it to solve a problem, and is expecting a very definite outcome: passing. You can't always achieve that, as limitations exist, but most people are expectant. Some surgeons can quite radically alter the way you look, in the sense of masculine versus feminine, without losing the individual character of you face and without looking like you have had lots of plastic surgery.

Not all of them are expensive as Dr Ousterhout, though money seems to be a very big factor as to whether a person will or won't have FFS. It isn't cheap, and many people would put SRS ahead of it, which is understandable. I too have heard people say that the pain is excruciating, but I doubt it is really that bad for most, and certainly not something that can't be tolerated for the sake of looking better.

Yes that is true in those cases, and I can imagine it being a godsend, but I didn't mention it since it isn't really the case with the OP.

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It's never too late to be who you might have been. - Mary Ann Evans