What is most important to you

there is a lot of talk about skin quality, hair and so on but what would you be prepared to sacrifice to pass

put these in order of importance to you

Hair
Adams Apple
Skin
Voice
Weight
Fashion Sense
Nails
Legs
Feet Size
Hand Size
Height
Beard (please state FTM or MTF) as beard need is different here
Chest (please state FTM or MTF)

any other areas i may have missed
I have avoided genitals as these are not part of passing in public

here is my list

Voice
First and foremost Voice - you could look like a supermodel sound like a guy and you are cream crackered - answer the phone and if the person says is that mrs ... you are laughing and have cracked it

Hair
Bald Women struggle - unless they are cool types like Sinead o connor

Beard
Facial Hair is a problem and its worth risking skin damage than having a beard IMO - in an emergency you may not have time to shave - in the middle of the night for example

Height
It can make one stand out - fortunately better diets are making women taller

Legs
Nice Legs can really help

Hand size
Many people read trans on hand size

Adams Apple
If you are too thin this will destroy all your efforts a double chin helps lol

Skin
If people get that close you probably dont have to worry anyhow - if you happen to have pockmarks then get a chemical peel but get your electrolysis finished first

Weight
Just purely for health reasons - although a little weight does help mtf women pass

Chest - this can be faked fairly easy but a concern for many

Feet - there are great shoes for larger sizes - in anycases plenty of natal women have big feet and they manage - inc celebrities who are photographed often

Fashion Sense - you could wear a boiler suit and still pass - if its just about passing

Nails - who cares buy some stick on ones - many women trim them level now anyway and mothers would injure their kids if they had them

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Man [...] must count no one but himself; that he is alone, abandoned on earth in the midst of his infinite responsibilities, without help, with no other aim than the one he sets himself, with no other destiny than the one he forges for himself on this earth." (Jean Paul Sartre, 1943)

Voice
I agree with you putting this at number 1, but my attempts are pretty rubbish!

Hair
Mine was falling out, which is one of the reasons for not waiting for a doctor to prescibe me what i need.

Skin
The condtion of my skin is awful. It doesn't look so bad in the daytime, but at night under artificial lights it looks like the surface of the moon

Beard
Has to be gotten rid of.

Height
I'm only 5'5 but i think bring to tall could be curse. It makes a person stand out more in a crowd.

Adams apple
Dead give away, i've been lucky here and haven't got one

Weight
I think being a bit plump does help. I was 8 stone when i came out and i looked ill. I've put on 2 stone since then and look far healthier for it.

Chest
It helps if you've got a chest, but it is possible to use chicken fillets to pad things out

Hands
Who looks at hands? As long as there in good condtion and not the size of spades, and disportionate to the rest of the body i don't think anybody would notice. My hands are only ever so slightly wider than my sisters.

Fashion
I do think it helps wearing clothes that suit you. I look horrible if wear something that is to frilly, for example.
However, please don't wear something that looks like it's been made out curtains from the 1980's. Please!!!

Legs
If you want to wear skirts, you've got to have nice legs. My legs were too thin and i had knobberly knees , but since i put on weight that has gone.

Feet
I can see it is a bugger to find shoes that fit if your feet are over a size 7. I'm again quite luckly, because my feet are a size 6.

Nails
When i was working i used to contantly cut chunks out of my nails with the hand pieces we use for are work(think of the type of thing that they have in nail salons), so my nails have always been quite short by necessity. There's always extensions anyway.

And my choice

Handwriting
Not quite so imperative when walking down the street, but when filling in forms and what not, i think it is quite important to have approrate handwriting. My handwriting is just a mess, but it looks the same as the girl who i used to work with, according to my ex boss .

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Out out!! You demons of stupidity!! - Saint Dogbert

This kind of thing can only create painful self-consciousness and feelings of inferiority.

The Ideology of Passing makes its believers into the hostage of the perceptions of strangers, a recipe for emotional disaster.

Freedom can only come from the social acceptance of gender variation, whilst the tyranny of passing demands that its subjects conform to the very stereotypes which oppress us.

i agree with stella.

plus, i can't work out what it's all about. some days i feel that i look like a million dollars and i get clocked. other days i feel like i look awful and i don't get clocked.

so, my guide to passing:

Voice:
get local speech therapy, have really good results, and then wreck your vocal chords singing in a rock band.

Adams Apple:
hope the thyroid condition gives you just enough goit to cover it up.

Skin:
occasionally use cleansing lotion, and always use moisturiser. however, make sure you always go to bed without taking your make-up off and hope that your forehead isn't so shiny as to allow the various chicken pox scars glint in the light.

Hair
get cut every six months or so by cute hairdresser. otherwise, brush and stick underneath hat, in bunches, or just allow to do it's own thing.

Weight:
tell all your friends that a little extra weight is a good thing, because it brings sexy curvaceousness, but secretly try and get yourself back down to about nine and a half stone, because you're kinda intrested in cruising with being underweight. just 'cause.

Fashion Sense:
aim to rewrite it. or at least that's what you tell yourself as you waltz about in a skirt that is about five years old and blotchy from engine oil.

Nails:
bite regularly and enjoy chipped varnish. keep suitably trim on left hand for purposes of holding down the five guitar chords you know.

Legs:
keenly moisturise, otherwise the eczema kicks in. assist general look by wearing fishnets over slashed ten denier tights.

Feet Size:
try not to mention in polite company.

Hand Size:
pray that the folklore is true and that such really does correspond to vaginal depth.

Height:
stand next to tall people with glee.

Beard:
i can hack them, but i'd rather he shave.

Chest
full to the brim with pirate treasure!


seems to work for me.

Handwriting?

Graphoanalysis is an interesting hobby and I understand from a friend that age and gender are two things that you cannot determine from someone's handwriting.

_________________
The Daily Turnout - King of the Throne Room

_________________
Man [...] must count no one but himself; that he is alone, abandoned on earth in the midst of his infinite responsibilities, without help, with no other aim than the one he sets himself, with no other destiny than the one he forges for himself on this earth." (Jean Paul Sartre, 1943)

ho hum, I pass, what priorities could I have now
Perhaps fixing the chest so I can pass without the aid of lycra

Hair - My level of confidence in facing the big wide world has had a direct link with the growth of my hair. I put this above voice, because I currently have no real need to pass over the phone for now, my need to pass is biased in favour of visual.

Voice - Well I do need to talk from time to time

Beard - I could have the best voice, the best hair, the best make-up and the best clothes, but wouldn't stand a chance of passing with a whole heap of five o'clock shadow.

Body Hair - not on the list but looking like a gorilla isn't great for passing.

Skin - Though I think this is less important the older you get, still worth looking after though whatever your age

Fashion Sense - A dayglow mini dress is hardly the best way to go unnoticed!

Chest - They helped me out once at a Stand up comedy show, when I was initially misread

Hand Size - I wish mine were smaller, but its isn't that high on my list

Shoe Size - Choice of shoe is more important for me, and it is getting easier to find nice ones.

Nails - not essential for passing

Weight - Either or is good for passing, the critical thing is muscle or lack of it.

I feel genitals should get a mention, I wear shorts and trousers more often than skirts, i feel avoiding the bulge is fairly critical for passing.

And Jenny, 5'5 and size 6! lucky cow! from a jealous 6'2 size 9!!!

_________________
Man [...] must count no one but himself; that he is alone, abandoned on earth in the midst of his infinite responsibilities, without help, with no other aim than the one he sets himself, with no other destiny than the one he forges for himself on this earth." (Jean Paul Sartre, 1943)

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forum moderator

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The Daily Turnout - King of the Throne Room

facial hair, no thats something i have to have when im older.

the hair is probably one of the most important things for ftms to pass, a good haircut can really change your face shape.

chest- no probs there. im flat as a pancake but i can imagine how a large chest can compromise passing.

dunno wat to do about the butt tho, apparently dark trousers and bright patterned tops are supposed to help. I havent noticed any difference

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"...risk something, take back whats yours, say something that you know they might attack you for..."

As i said, I don't know as I don't have that problem, but I'm always impressed by the difference binders make to larger guys so I know they do something, even if it doesn't enable them to wear anything tight fitting.

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forum moderator

there is a big difference though, mentally, between being flat, and still having moobs. Yeah, I am a lot flatter when I bind, but it still doesn't look natural, even in loose clothes. And, you know, it would be nice to be able to wear the clothes normal guys wear. And to be able to go for a whole day without having to hide in the toilets to readjust myself. And heat rash isn't particularly fun, either.